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Mensaje Gladiator A.D. de Wii

#1  Ryo Suzuki 07 Junio 2013, 12:24 PM

Este es uno de esos juegos más que cancelados podríamos decir modificados o incluso rediseñados en gran medida que hacen que el producto final sea muy diferente a lo que en un principio se tenía pensado. Empecemos con este video para meteros uno poco en situación:


Como véis, se trataba de un título de lucha situado en la época de los gladiadores y con un toque bastante gore y despiadado, al estilo quizás del recordado Mortal Kombat y otros juegos en los que no se cortaban un pelo en aspectos como el de finiquitar a nuestro rival...

Pues bien, ahora echadle un ojo a este otro video que os pongo a continuación. Es ya del Tournament of Legends, que es como se acabó llamando el juego finalmente cuando salió a la venta, apreciaréis unas notables diferencias:


YouTube Link

¡¡Vaya!! Parece ser que la cosa cambió y mucho. El look visual oscuro, que recuerda un poco a la película 300, ha sido sustituido por uno más colorista e iluminado y los personajes han pasado de ser gladiadores a... digamos otra cosa en otra dirección, en plan dioses de la mitología greco-romana.

Por supuesto, lo más reseñable es la casi desaparición del tema sanguinolento orientando la jugabilidad. Y también se puede ver que las habilidades de los luchadores acabaron derivando hacia un campo algo más místico, por calificarlo de alguna forma...
gladiator_ad_wii
Este es un título que yo personalmente no conocía y que comentó en otro post el amigo FacundoARG. Sí que recuerdo haber visto el juego por alguna tienda, pero tengo que reconocer que no llamó para nada la atención.

Es una obra del estudio yanki High Voltage Software, que muchos recordaréis por las dos entregas de Conduit también en Wii, o por los dos Hunter: The Reckoning de Xbox. El juego fue presentado en su primera encarnación como Gladiator A.D. en el E3 del 2009 y a principios del 2010 se llegó a un acuerdo para que SEGA fuese el editor del título. A la postre, esto parece ser lo que motivó el cambió en la dirección del proyecto.

El juego usa y usaba (tanto como Gladiator, como en el Tournament of Legends) el Quantum 3 engine, diseñado en principio para Conduit por la propia High Voltage Software. El motor era bastante bastante ambicioso para correr en la sobremesa de Nintendo y creo que sacó un buen partido del hardware.

En Gladiator A.D. como hemos ido comentando nos metíamos en la piel de un gladiador en busca de la gloria, con su propia historia y sus motivaciones personales. El objetivo era llegar a convertirse en el campeón absoluto de Roma y cada luchador tendría evidentemente sus propios ataques especiales y un estilo definido de combate.

IGN hizo una entrevista a varios de los miembros de su staff, creo que es bastante reveladora. Echadle un ojo, si os apetece:

Citar:
Pre-E3 2009: Gladiator A.D. Revealed
The developer of The Conduit unveils its new Wii game, an ultra-gory fighter inspired by the movie 300.
by Matt Casamassina MAY 25, 2009



Next week the Electronic Entertainment Expo kicks off in Los Angeles, where hundreds of new games will be unveiled or shown in updated form. Development studio High Voltage Software, best known to Wii owners for its first-person shooter The Conduit, has not one, but two new games in the works for Nintendo's console. The first, revealed exclusively on IGN today, is called Gladiator A.D. and it's a brutal fighter that takes players back to ancient Rome to do bloody battle. (The other title will be revealed on IGN tomorrow, so stay tuned.) We caught up with High Voltage's CEO and founder Kerry Ganofsky, chief creative officer Eric Nofsinger and design director David Pellas to learn more about Gladiator A.D. We've also posted the first screenshots and concept art for the game below.

IGN: You're just wrapping up work on The Conduit. Tell us about the concept behind Gladiator A.D.

Kerry J. Ganofsky: Gladiator A.D. is our next step in filling the holes in the Wii's library. Players choose a Gladiator, each with unique attacks, behaviors, moves, and weapons. They then battle through a series of competitions, some one-on-one and some much more complex.

David Pellas: The concept for Gladiator A.D. is to recreate the brutal fighting and high tension of the gladiatorial arenas of ancient Rome. We are developing a game that is both fast-paced and tactical in nature. A lot of work into the art style as well as the AI systems to make a game that is not only beautiful to look at, but challenging and well-balanced for all skill levels.

Eric Nofsinger: Gladiator A.D. takes strategic combat mechanics and steps it up a notch with an RPG-light twist and more player options. Players take their gladiator into one of history's most brutal blood sports; the Roman Gladiatorial Circuit. After winning enough favor from the crowd, players can challenge the champions for fame, wealth, and in some cases, freedom stand waiting to the victor.

IGN: Who do you play as?

Eric: Players have the option of playing as one of many gladiators, ranging from the Dark Druids of Amesbury, to the daughter of an Egyptian priest. Special achievements will unlock new gladiators, such as the current arena champion and even the emperor himself. Each character has an intricate story, abilities, and motivations to encourage playing through the game with all the different gladiators.

David: We are going to great lengths to make sure that every fighter not only looks unique, but plays uniquely.

Kerry: We are offering many playable characters with different backgrounds and fighting styles. Each character has a unique storyline and interacts with the other characters in different ways.

IGN: What's the storyline and how are you telling story in the game?

Kerry: The story for each character revolves around the gladiatorial circuit culminating in the Coliseum to determine the grand champion. The characters all have unique motivations to rise to the top. The player can choose to be ruthless or forgiving, affecting the storyline of the character.

David: And the story line is different for each fighter. Some fight for honor, some for revenge, and still others fight for the pleasure of ending an opponent's life. We have a very deep story mode which includes many elements of traditional RPG games, but we are being careful not to bog the player down with endless menus.

Eric: Each of the selectable gladiators has his/her unique story, rival, and plot twists. These stories are earned by unlocking events based on player decision. Choosing to allow your rival to live, rather than putting him to the sword will cause later repercussions. These events are different between the gladiators.

IGN: The Conduit's Quantum3 engine pushes Wii tech. What about Gladiator? What's happening tech-wise with this project that you're proud of?

Kerry: We are using the Quantum3 engine for Gladiator as well. Improvements are continually being made to the engine and we are taking full advantage of each update. Being an arena-style game, we are able to push the graphics up a few notches. Our characters, environments and animations are simply amazing. The AI system is adjustable and flexible which will allow our designers to make each enemy feel unique and challenging.

Eric: Think of Gladiator A.D. as the distillation of everything that made Conduit what it was. With fewer characters in smaller environments we are able to get more detail. In addition, we are utilizing our imposter system to get the crowd reacting to the player's action. Watch them throw objects at the ill-favored gladiator, as well as stand and cheer with large hits, or boo and jeer when the player uses cheap tactics.

David: Gladiator A.D. features the latest version of the Quantum technology. Graphically, we have incorporated several very cool visual effects into the game that are beyond even The Conduit. All of the updates are not simply graphical though, as seen in our Imposter / Instancing technology. This technology allows us to feature a large number of characters on screen with no discernible framerate hit. This means that we can have hundreds or even thousands of models in the scene.

IGN: Is Gladiator a straight-up 3D fighter? What are the gameplay mechanics?

David: Gladiator A.D. is not a traditional 3D fighting game. It's more of a hybrid between 3D Fighting games like Bushido Blade and Boxing games like Fight Night. The action is intense, but the combat is strategic. You need to learn your opponent's weaknesses and think through your attack patterns to succeed. There is no button-mashing here.

Kerry: Our goal is to make the controls intuitive while providing depth to the game mechanics. Customizable weapons, armor and moves give the player a lot of choices of the arsenal to bring into battle. There are quicker, lighter moves that are difficult to block or dodge and slower, heavier moves that will do more damage. A well-timed parry will briefly stun your opponent. There are brutality moves that the player can earn by increasing crowd favor, which plays a big role in a player's victory or defeat.

Eric: Gladiator takes an over-the-should approach to bring the player right into the action. With the Wii-remotes representing the right and left hand, the player can accurately control his attacks, blocks, and dodges. The player has three directional attack; left slice, right slash, and overhead chop. As well as a slower, but devastating power attack for each direction. On the defense, the player can choose to dodge, parry, or block attacks. Holding block will soak a percentage of the incoming damage, but moving your shield or secondary weapon using the analog stick (while blocking) will allow the player to make perfect blocks, which soaks all damage, and causes his opponent to react, allowing for a retaliatory strike. We incorporate slow down of the larger power attacks, similar to the movie 300, to allow players a cinematic attempt to perfect block these attacks.

IGN: How do you control the game? Please be specific? Are you using Wii MotionPlus for anything?

Kerry: The controls use Wii motions with the Wii remote and nunchuck to initiate an attack. There are six basic attacks: Left, right or overhead, both light and heavy. The player can also block or dodge in any direction.

David: We are taking full advantage of the Wii Remote's motion-sensing capabilities for combat. We are very proud of what we have been able to accomplish using just the Wii Remote. That said though, we are currently incorporating the latest version of the Wii MotionPlus firmware and will support it.

Eric: The Wii MotionPlus will be used to add variance to the attacks to break up what could possibly be seen as mechanical attacks. For example, depending on the orientation of the player's wrist when a left slice is initiated, the gladiator will attack his opponents right side from one of three angles, making it slightly more difficult to perfect block player's using the Wii MotionPlus. We are also looking into other applications for optional game-play with this peripheral.

IGN: Can you play the game using different control methods?

Kerry: We are all about customization and player choice. Of course!

David: We are evaluating every method of play, but right now we have been strictly focused on providing the best gameplay with the Wii remote and nunchuk.

Eric: Please understand that this does not mean we will not have alternate modes of control, it simply means that we are still evaluating the use of them.

IGN: Gladiators endured a lot of violence. Just how violent is this Wii game?

David: This game is brutally violent, but is not Mortal Kombat. There is no over-the-top spine ripping. Its authentic, not ridiculous. We do have finishers, which can get pretty nasty to watch though.

Kerry: We have execution, humiliation, and brutality moves on top of the devastating attacks. One humiliation has certain tender body parts being stomped on…repeatedly. The life of a gladiator is not always pretty.

David: The camera work is fantastic and really drives home the humiliation that is being inflicted, not to mention the pain.

Eric: While in development, if we don't get a wince out of team mates during the creation of some of the more brutal animations and attacks we take another pass. The player can use the environment as well to throw his opponent into spiked columns, fire basins, and in front of ravenous lions. Each gladiator uses a different set of weapons, some more exotic depending on the character's background and origin.

IGN: What kinds of weapons can you use? Will the environments play a part? And what about outside forces, like tigers? Hey – we saw Gladiator.

David: Did someone slip you an early release? The game has a ton of unique weapons.

Kerry: Each character specializes in a certain weapon style. We have the standard gladius and shield as well as a variety of more exotic weapons such as dual scimitars. The environments will contain hazards that will play into the brutality system.

David: Yes, the environments do play a large role into the combat and yes there will be outside forces that can affect the outcome of the fight. Lions are just the start...

IGN: The movie 300 presented its action very cinematically. Will Gladiator A.D. strive for the same kind of presentation? How so?

David: We love the movie 300 and it is safe to say that we were inspired by the movie. As to the exact presentation, we are looking to provide a very cinematic style of game but to maintain our own vision as to how that is going to be represented.

Kerry: Each arena will present a slightly different take on the overall coloring and lighting of the scene. The details in the characters and environments lend themselves very well to the art style.

Eric: The presentation is extremely important. In the development of this project, each fight needs to have a moment that causes the player to look around and ask, "Did you just see that?!" Whether it is a gladiator barely dodging under a horizontal power attack as the slow-mo kicks in, or when a gladiator is grappled, beaten and thrown into environmental hazards, the intent is to create something that spectators would cheer about, in-game and out-of-game.

IGN: We're included a few soundtrack samples in today's article. Tell us about the music for the game.

David: We want to engulf players in the atmosphere and music is one of the biggest ways to drive a players emotion. The game soundtrack is filled with epic orchestral tracks that are designed to be as much of an integral part of the game experience as the fighting mechanics themselves. We are taking music very seriously in this game. So much so, that we hired Emmy winning composer Jeff Beal to create our music. Jeff is the musical genius behind the music of the HBO epic drama series Rome.

The Pit (MP3 download)
The Tomb (MP3 download)
Eric: Jeff's authentic take on Rome and his use of exotic instruments brings the blood and sweat to life in the sands of the grand coliseum.

Kerry: I find the music exotic and captivating. Noah Jurcin, one of our sound designers, is working diligently to put the action together with the music to make it dynamic and adaptive.

IGN: We figure a multiplayer mode has to be in for a Gladiator game. How's it going to work?

Eric: We are implementing a split-screen mode for multiplayer. We currently have it running in either horizontal or vertical configuration for player customization.

David: We do have a full two-player mode like traditional fighting games. Each player chooses a combatant and the fight ensues. We have a ton of unique ways to beef up the experience, but unfortunately we cannot talk about those yet.

IGN: Is there online play mode? If so, how's that work?

Kerry: That certainly would be cool. [Smiles] Seriously though, we are still solidifying our Wii network solution.

IGN: Will you have online leaderboards, etc.? Any other Nintendo Wi-Fi Connection support? What about WiiSpeak support?

David: Now I am not confirming online play, but if we were to offer it we would certainly have some great ground work in place that was generated during the development of The Conduit.

IGN: How far along is the game in development and when do you hope to release it for Wii?

David: We are seven months into full production. We have nearly every environment complete and many of our fighters have been modeled, rigged, and animated. As to the specific release date, we are not announcing anything yet but we are very excited and eager to get the games into the hands of the gamers.

Kerry: The game is a lot of fun to play and our current timetable places us at a Q1 2010 release.

IGN: Any final words for Wii owners seeing the title for the first time?

Kerry: The team has been working very hard on making Gladiator A.D. a fun, brutal and beautiful game.

David: Gladiator A.D. is going to redefine the fighting game genre on the Wii. The game features an unmatched graphic fidelity, enthralling musical score, and strategic combat. This coupled with the familiar setting and intuitive controls are what sets it apart from anything ever released.

Eric: Just like with the Conduit, we want to hear what you have to say about Gladiator A.D. Feel free to drop us a note at .

Fuente original: IGN


Como habéis visto muchísima información interesante en esta entrevista. Quiero recordar que el juego terminó saliendo como Tournament of Legends en Julio del 2006, no muy lejos de la fecha estimada que comentan, por lo que podemos asumir que la reconversión casi total que hicieron del proyecto la realizaron un muy poco tiempo (Quizás por eso precisamente la cosa no les quedó demasiado bien...).

Otra detalle curioso es que el juego que finalmente llegó a nuestras tiendas no tiene soporte para Wii MotionPlus, a pesar de que en la entrevista se menciona que lo van a añadir. Esto tendrá su explicación gracias a otra entrevista que concedieron luego.

Os pongo algunos videos más de la primera encarnación como Gladiator A.D.:


YouTube Link



YouTube Link

Y para finalizar, otra entrevista que complementaría a la primera donde tratan de explicar el porqué del cambió tan drástico en el juego y de paso hablan de The Grinder, precisamente otro juego cancelado de la misma casa del que quizás hablemos otro día:

Citar:
Interview with High Voltage Software's Josh Olson
Tournament of Legends and The Grinderby Aaron Kaluszka - March 20, 2010 - 11:30 A.M.

We talk to the producer of The Conduit about lessons learned from that game, as well as what we can expect from their upcoming games.


NWR: What elements of Tournament of Legends couldn't have been done when it was first known as Gladiator A.D.?

JO: We found it limiting initially, after we worked on the grittier "300" style, and allowed for some variation and changes in the characters. And I think as a license, as a property, we would've hit a wall initially. We opened it up, took a more fantastical, mythological, magical approach. Our mixing of mythology has been pretty loose with the story and authenticity. We really opened it up and I think it makes it a much broader game experience than it would've been had we stuck with the original direction.

NWR: What happened to the MotionPlus support that was talked about earlier?

Pat Dolan, Designer: Wii controls are incredible. The motion controls are really, really fun. But, what we discovered is that it's very, very tricky to get instantaneous response and accuracy at the same time. It is very hard to pull that off. So initially, we were left with that challenge, and solved it without the Wii MotionPlus. When the opportunity came to incorporate Wii MotionPlus, we had a choice: We could either throw out everything we'd done and rewire it or something like that, or we could just keep our existing solution. And frankly we decided to go with what we already had working. I know we had it functional and that we looked at it. It's something we'd love to take advantage of in the future. It was just a case of bad timing. We'd already solved the situations that we needed. It actually has even more potential. The Wii MotionPlus would've allowed us to do more, but then we would've had to go back and change our gameplay to support that, and again, the timeline just didn't connect originally.

NWR: How do you feel about the other gladiator-style games shown recently? There's the WiiWare game Rage of the Gladiator, and also Gladiator Duel using Sony's PlayStation Move.

JO: I saw the WiiWare one very briefly. I haven't seen the one for the Move. I played around with the Move. We have them at the office and they're a lot of fun. I think there are a lot of cool things you can do with it, so I'm looking forward to seeing it. In terms of gladiator games, I think we're going to see more. It's an under-represented genre.

NWR: So it doesn't deter you at all?

JO: No, the more, the merrier I think.

NWR: One of our forum members was wondering why High Voltage keeps showing games, and then changing the overall look and play style so drastically between reveal and release.

JO: Well, with both titles [Tournament of Legends and The Grinder], we were fortunate enough to be able to start development on our own, so we had our own money to spend on developing them, and part of that iterative process is changing things, finding things that don't work, tweaking it, adjusting it, and making sure it feels good. I like the direction that both of the titles have taken.

Why do we show things early and then change them? It's the nature of development. We're a smaller company, and we want to get the news out there for stuff we're working on. But things do change. I hope fans appreciate it. I hope fans see the direction change is a good thing, and I think once they get hands-on time, they will.

NWR: In regards to The Grinder, what was the impetus behind the new direction?

JO: We looked at titles out there; there's plenty of FPSs on 360 and PS3, and we went multi-platform. We saw that there was a market for a title that we did called "Hunter." It was on Xbox, GameCube and PS2 back in the day. And a sequel to that's a constant request from fans, from press. We really liked this universe. We kind of had The Grinder be a spiritual successor to that title, which did very well for us.

NWR: So officially, what is the status of The Grinder on Wii?

JO: We're planned for it, then we switched to Infernal Engine; the focus has been on PS3 and 360. We're very interested in pursuing Wii titles. We think there are great opportunities out there on the Wii. We're kind of still defining--the engine does work on the Wii--we're defining what the Wii SKU will be.

NWR: So you'd actually think about switching the whole engine as well?

JO: Well, initially it was on Quantum3, and we're still doing games on Quantum3, and it's nice to have that flexibility between Quantum3 and Infernal, which are both great engines. We can do a lot with them. We haven't quite decided yet.

NWR: What improvements have been made to the Quantum3 engine since The Conduit?

JO: They're constantly adding stuff. The big thing is tools. It's not something that gamers see, but better tools for our designers and artists to be able to use all the cool tech we have. We have some new lighting tools, some new visual effects tools. A lot of work on our lighting and light maps and, you wouldn't think it, but lighting is one of the big things that make games look really nice, so we have some new lighting, rendering tools available to us. Our water renderer just went through a couple new iterations, so our water is looking better than ever. A lot of performance optimization has been done so we can have bigger levels now and better-looking levels.

NWR: Would you be able to bring some of those optimizations so that the online version of The Conduit looked like the single-player?

JO: We want the game to look really nice. There are some sacrifices you have to make on multiplayer. You're passing a lot more data, there's always going to be some differences between single-player and multiplayer experiences, but I think that gap is going to get smaller and smaller as we continue to optimize and learn new things and new tricks to improve the experience.

NWR: Have you tried licensing out Quantum3 at all yet?

JO: No, we like having a nice competitive advantage with Quantum3. It's not something we've pursued.

NWR: One of our forum members wanted to know what they have to do to get the FPS version, or even both versions on the Wii.

JO: Send us emails, post on the forums, make a lot of noise... We love FPSs, especially on the Wii. Making Conduit was a great first step for us. The thing with The Conduit was we were learning the tech, and at the same time making the game. There are a lot of things we would love to clean up and polish up, but we're really proud of it. We think it was a great first entry into the genre. But there's a lot of room for improvement too, and we recognize that. FPSs on the Wii are very, very viable, and something High Voltage is very interested in. Right now, nothing is off the table.

NWR: There are several third-party developers, especially recently, talking about how mature games are a tough sell on the Wii, due to family-friendly appeal. Did that have any bearing on the recent changes to these two titles?

JO: I still think there's a market on the Wii. I'm very curious to see how Red Steel 2 does; I hope it does well. Modern Warfare Reflex has done very well. The Conduit did well. But I think there is a market there. I think people want to generalize and say they don't do well on the console, but that's not exactly true. In terms of the changes to The Grinder and Tournament of Legends, that more came from internally, from us as a team. As I mentioned, creatively we could do more with the change of direction. I hope people can appreciate the new direction.

NWR: So I guess we can't expect the 20 seconds of ball-stomping anymore in Tournament of Legends?

JO: No, that's frowned upon by ratings boards. Testicle crushing is out, unfortunately.

Fuente: Nintendo World Report


Creo que ahí ya se despejan bastante las dudas que planteabamos. Lo voy a dejar aquí, al menos de momento. Os pongo algo de arte conceptual de los escenarios de Gladiator A.D.:

gladiator a d wii unreleased


gladiator a d wii unreleased


Y algunas capturas también del juego:

 gladiator_ad_wii2  

gladiator_ad_wii7

 gladiator_ad_wii_3  

gladiator_ad_wii_4  

gladiator_ad_wii_5  

gladiator_ad_wii_6  

gladiator_ad_wii_1370599885_776460

En fin, que en mi opinión estamos ante uno de esos casos en los que la concepción inicial del título era posiblemente mejor que la que acabó saliendo. Gladiator A.D., sin seguramente ser una obra maestra, podría haber sido mejor juego que lo que acabó saliendo como Tournament of Legends. El producto que salió a la venta fue calificado de mediocre y fue rapidamente olvidado por todo el mundo, mientras que quizás el juego original hubiera tenido más calado. Aunque también hay que reconocer que la aureola de juego unreleased/cancelado siempre otorga a cualquier título un plus especial.

Eso es todo, si os interesa podemos indagar más de este juego en el futuro.

tournament_of_legends1

 




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#2  FacundoARG 07 Junio 2013, 04:54 PM

Una lástima la verdad. El juego tiene excelentes gráficos, de lo mas aceptable en Wii pero es pésimo.
 




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#3  segatasanshiro 07 Junio 2013, 08:23 PM

Yo viendo la concepcion inicial creo que metieron la pata hasta al fondo cambiandolo,lo que salio al final es una bazofia comparado con los videos del principio.
Supongo que harian esos cambios porque pensarian que era un juego muy gore para la Wii,no seria hasta Mad World cuando se demostro que en Wii tambien se podian hacer cosas hardcore.

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#4  Jose 08 Junio 2013, 06:32 PM

Una pena,eso es cierto.
 



 
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#5  TimeDevouncer 08 Junio 2013, 11:06 PM

A mi el juego en un primer momento me llamaba...tenía mis dudas ya que el estudio no es santo de mi devoción (no puedo con los Conduit, vaya pestuños de juegos -con perdón si algún fan de la saga me lee-, eso sí, el final del Conduit 2 es lo mejor que han visto mis ojos    ), pero cuando vi el cambio gráfico, la eliminación de los gladiadores realistas por esas...cosas, pues aluciné pepinillos   .

Cuando salió y por medio de artes oscuras (no pago ese juego, sorry) lo probé y Dios, que media hora más mal gastada.

P.D. Por si alguien tiene curiosidad por el final del Conduit 2 que he mencionado antes, lo dejo en spoiler:

Spoiler: [ Mostrar ]

 



 
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#6  omi_payaso 11 Junio 2013, 12:27 AM

Pues fue brusco en extremo el cambio de aires del juego mas en mi opinión así estuviera super realista la sangre y el sadismo de terminar cruelmente con el adversário hubiese sido algo monotono pues ese tipo de genero ha sido ya demasiado explotado y a estas alturas se quiebran la cabeza para hallar originalidad. Aunque en el caso de este juego tal vez si el rediseño fue por la violencia cruda fue un grande error quitar el brillo y la dedicación hecha en un principio o sea resultaria mejor quitar la sangre y asunto arreglado para dejar el arte bien logrado del principio del proyecto, ya después lo de menos es el nombre pues, aunque desagradable para algunos, existen numerosos video gamers que aluscinan con este tipo de juegos en especial para competir con los hermanos o las visitas . Una lástima que se perdiera el original y queda el hambre de haber probado lo que hubiese sido:?
 



 
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Mensaje Re: Gladiator A.D. De Wii

#7  kikonan 15 Junio 2013, 05:18 PM

Paso de ser mas que un posible Must have a un juego mediocre (eso si con buenos gráficos)
Me lo imagino compatible con el Motion plus y cuanto mejor no le habría ido a este "Gladiator"
 




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